Speaking As Real Human Technology

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Hey dear listeners. There's a quiet uh truth about the world, you know, that we live in and that nobody quite says out loud. Right? Almost like every meaningful change that you have ever made started with something or someone speaking, right? A teacher in the room, a founder at a podium, friend at the kitchen table, maybe a stranger at a conference who said the exact sentence that you needed to hear at the exact moment of your life and was ready to hear it. So speaking is not just a kind of skill, I'd say. It is the oldest I mean, I'd say technology that we have for moving a human being from one version of themselves to another. And yet most people with something genuinely important to say spend their whole lives talking themselves out of saying it. They wait for the permission, they wait for the credentials, they wait for the moment that they'll feel ready. And the message they were carrying never makes it out of the room they are standing in. Yeah. So hey day listeners, we'll be talking about

The Hidden Machines Behind Messages

SPEAKER_01 1:16

this. So welcome back to Mind Meets Machine. I'm your host awake, and today we are going to talk about the different kinds of machines. Like the one a person builds around their message, business engine behind a speaking career, and the systems that run what someone says into something that actually reaches people, right? Uh changes lives and guess obviously pays the bill. Like because the I mean the romantic story of the speaker uh on the stage skips over kind of uh much bigger truth. So uh right, so I mean everyone who makes uh so everyone who makes a life out of this also quietly running a business, and the people who pretend that part doesn't exist are the ones who never actually get to speak.

Meet Marianne Hickman And Her Mission

SPEAKER_01 2:06

And my guest today, we have a very lovely guest with us today. Uh please welcome Marianne Hickman. So welcome to the show.

SPEAKER_00 2:13

Thank you so much for first of all doing this podcast. I think the world very much needs what you're putting together. And uh thanks for having me on.

SPEAKER_01 2:20

Always welcome and thank you so much for joining us today. And dear listeners, like before we delve deep into the discussion, I quickly love to introduce with Marianne. So Marianne is an international speaker, uh, speaker coach, sales coach, and the founder of This Is Me LLC and uh the I mean This Is Me movement. So she's been on over like 2,000 stages around the world, taught in 17 countries, and build a body of work helping experts, coaches, and entrepreneurs monetize their message. So her story is I would say is one of the most quietly powerful in this space. So from single mom on food stamps to a multi-uh six-figure career, married to her best friend. Uh shall I use the name or yeah, go ahead. Yeah. So married to her best friend uh Richard and ra raising six children and somehow like finding stages every week, right? So uh it's exactly and so there's a lot of a lot of things to learn from her. So I'll not take much of her time, dear listeners. Uh let's get started and uh welcome to the show again, Marianne.

SPEAKER_00 3:24

Wonderful. I I hope the people that are listening are are leaning in and leaning forward, especially if you have a mission in your heart, something impactful you want to leave behind. And I'm not just saying if you want to have a million followers or a million subscribers, that's not what I'm necessarily gonna teach you how to do today. It's not what we're gonna talk about. What I'm hoping to do is those people that are looking to leave a legacy that outlives them, looking to have a note that is mailed to them saying thank you, looking to have it real significance, not just limelight. That's what I want to talk about. Amazing.

SPEAKER_01 3:58

Amazing. That is that is really, really great. So uh

The Chinese Bamboo Speaker Myth

SPEAKER_01 4:01

I want to start somewhere like to be honest, like because I think there's a misconception, uh, obviously, right at the center of how the world talks about speaking. The kind of dominant story is that great speakers are born and not made, right? So I'll again I'll again say that if great speakers are born and they are not made. So I mean that it's uh it's about the charisma and stage presence, the right look, the right voice, the right confidence. And and the rest of us, by implication, we're not given those gifts, right? So but I have a feeling that after 2000 stages, you have definitely you have pushback on that heart. So if you can just share with us, like what do most people fundamentally uh misunderstand about who actually gets to be a speaker.

SPEAKER_00 4:54

You know, it's interesting because when we think about becoming a speaker, we can only really think about people who have in some ways arrived. We think about the people who are speaking on very large stages, the Gary V's of the world, the Tony Robbins of the world, the Cody Sanchezes of the world. And we think about this because they are widely known. We only step into their lives after they have, once again, achieved that that threshold. But the crazy part is it's like, I don't know if you've ever heard this, it's the analogy before of Chinese bamboo. Chinese bamboo is a very, have you heard of this before? The the the life cycle?

SPEAKER_01 5:33

Not exactly, but this Chinese bamboo I heard, not in detail I have.

SPEAKER_00 5:38

Yeah. I'll give you a quick summary. So the the way that Chinese bamboo works is when you want to grow it from scratch as opposed to buying it, you'll you'll plant the seed into the ground and you'll give it the proper nutrition, the proper exposure to sunlight, the proper water, and it won't germinate. It won't sprout for over a year. In fact, it takes five years for the plant itself to break soil. But after five years, it grows quickly. It you can almost watch it. Some accounts say an inch a day, some accounts even say an inch an hour. We know it grows so quickly that it was even weaponized in world wars to assault the enemy. It was incredible. But the the crazy thing I want to point out is that the Chinese bamboo, it grows so quickly only because it had five years to create the root system that could support the growth. So when you take this into the speaking world, we see bamboo everywhere. We see bamboo on stages, we see bamboo on TikTok, on Instagram, on your social media and podcasts and whatever. But the crazy part is, in order for us to see that, there had to be sometimes five or 10 or 15 years of consistency, of nourishment, of speaking before it ever comes to fruition. So if you're excluding yourself from becoming a speaker or being a speaker, I want you to think about this. If you're uttering words, you are officially a speaker, even if you're not getting paid for it yet, even if you're not getting asked to speak on podcasts yet, even if you don't have your own podcast yet, if you're sharing your message, you are a speaker. And the way to become an exponential growth speaker and get the limelight if you want it is to stay consistent, but don't discredit where you start from.

SPEAKER_01 7:25

Okay.

unknown 7:26

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 7:27

So, and the person uh who is listening right now, who's quietly wondering like if they are allowed to be a speaker, then what is the one uh what is the thing that you wish someone had told you

Your Message Matters More Than Fame

SPEAKER_01 7:39

at the start?

SPEAKER_00 7:40

Well, I had I was very, very blessed to have a seventh grade teacher who believed in me. And her name is Mrs. Wilson. I don't even know if she's still alive. I would love to find her one day and tell her thank you. Because she, when I was, gosh, how old was I in seventh grade? Seven minus five is wait a second, seven plus five. Obviously, I didn't graduate. I was only 12 years old at the time. And she saw, she had the ability to see in me some, she called me a scholar. Okay. And she said, keep doing what you're doing. You have a gift with words. And I believed her. I don't know if she was just trying to encourage one of her students or if she really did see it. I like to think that she really did, but she was the first one that put me behind a podium. She was the first one that told me to keep speaking. She was the first one that encouraged me to write. And you might not have a Mrs. Wilson in your life. Maybe you do, but maybe you don't. And I'm going to tell you this right now. And I don't know if you're listening to this, I don't know your message. I don't know your heart. But here's what I do know about you. If you're listening to this podcast, it means you're looking at improving yourself. It means you want to become a better version of yourself. If you're listening to my words right now, I do know this about you, that you are looking at your life and saying, if I listen to this podcast, maybe I can get better at this. And if you're looking to better your own life, there's a pretty darn good chance you're looking to better the life of someone else along the way. That's what's going to make you grow. That's what's going to leave your legacy that long outlives your birth certificate, if I can put it that way. So if you, if that's you, I want you to know that your message matters. And like we said in the introduction, your message might affect the person who's driving down the road. Your message might affect the person that's at the drive-thru at this tour. Your message might affect the gas station attendant where you fill up your car and it might make their lives better. And maybe you won't seek fame and maybe you won't seek fortune, but the impact that you make on a daily basis is so important. And as a speaker, what's so beautiful about that is that you can make that impact many lives at a time. When you're willing to take the stage, when you're willing to hop on in front of the microphone, whether it's on a podcast or whether it's in a live room or whether it's on live on social media, you're willing to do that. Then you can affect more lives at once. And that's the super and super important thing because I'm going to tell you right now, we need your message. There are people that were born and need you because if without you, they won't hear it from anybody else. And I know that sounds hyperbolic and I know that sounds altruistic, and I know that sounds like motivational woo-hoo stuff. But I have to tell you it's so important because if you think back to the person that inspired you, what if they hadn't? And I have to tell you that some people will just plain go without if you don't show up.

SPEAKER_01 10:21

Very true, very true. And uh, you know, definitely I have to say that it it it it tracks because I think we have been uh sold a Hollywood version of like who a speaker is, and definitely you're naming something more accessible and far more honest, definitely. So I'd say I mean you don't have to I mean you don't need a perfect story, you need a true one. So not at all. I mean the the the the the stage doesn't decide if you're ready or not, you decide and that is a much bigger thing. So I mean people, it's it's all pretty clear. Crystal clear. I mean, no one need to worry about that. So yeah, and and if you just go a bit deeper, like uh I mean there's something specific because about your journey that I I definitely want to honor and definitely want to do with care, obviously, because you you didn't begin at the top, you begin at the kind of uh fo kind of food stamps single mom with dreams that probably felt unreasonable from where you were standing. And the rise from that point to where you are right now was not a kind of montage, so it was years of slow and the ordinary work. So if you can just share, like what did that season of your life actually teach you about

Food Stamps To Sales With Integrity

SPEAKER_01 11:42

the money, about message, about what entrepreneurship really is. So I mean if you can share.

SPEAKER_00 11:48

Yeah, and it's interesting because a lot of the wrong lessons can be learned when someone appears to become successful. And that that is so true in so many cases, and I definitely had exposure to cases like that. And when I was a single mom on food stamps, it was right after my divorce. And this was a really drawn-out process, insofar as that I was in this relationship that I knew we were operating on different goals, we were operating on different frequencies, but I held on for probably longer than I should have because I did not know what it was gonna mean for my children. And when I finally created that separation, I was now on my own. I was on my own to provide financially, I was on my own to provide emotionally. It's a whole new dynamic. And I remember coming home uh from the courthouse that day and ask myself, okay, how am I gonna do this? How am I gonna do this? And I was meeting with one of my mentors, and I remember staying at, you know, I was at his house for that afternoon, and he was a pretty mildly well-known YouTuber at the time. And I remember he had the a cell phone in his hand and he was talking to someone who had seen him speak on YouTube and wanted to buy a bunch of programs. And he had the phone up like this, and he he muted it and he covered it up and he said, Marianne, if I hand this phone to you and you sell this guy on this program, I'll give you a hundred bucks. And I was like, Well, he just talked to you. That should be pretty easy. So I took the phone, I sold it, I ran the credit card on whatever credit card processor I had at the time, and I got paid $100 to do that. And I thought, okay, maybe there's something to this. And I have to say the word sales doesn't usually mean something positive for a lot of people. Most people, when they hear the word sales, they're like, ugh, I don't like salesmen. They knock on my door, they try and sell me pest control, they they're just out to get the money and what's what have you. But I really understood and came to understand that the world of sales, influence, and speaking all came together in a really beautiful way if integrity was part of the equation. When integrity is not part of the equation, what's crazy is the equation still works, but it can't sustain itself. People can get very wealthy, very wealthy without integrity, but they cannot stay wealthy without integrity. People with integrity can get wealthy and stay wealthy. And that's exceptionally important to remember because it's the difference between influence and manipulation. It's the difference between authenticity and coercion, both of which use the same tools. People who get very, very good at influencing, they study body language, they study communication, they study psychology, they study sociology, but the heart of the person, whether they whether or not they have integrity, determines how far that will go. So when I was studying this, I honestly have to tell you, I was really repulsed by the idea of becoming good at sales because I did not want to become that. I didn't want to be manipulative. I didn't want to be what I had seen so prolifically demonstrated in front of me on social media. So I tried to find something that I could represent with integrity and I tried to match it with people who really could be blessed by it and needed it. And, you know, it's really unfortunate because it turns out that the product that I thought I was representing it exploded into some products that were integrous and some products that weren't. But in the all along the way, I met such incredible individuals. I was actually able to help a lot of people when I got good at sales. I was able to help people get out of debt. I was able to help people pay off their credit cards. I was able to pay off my own credit cards. I was able to pull myself off of four different kinds of welfare because this one rule, this core, core principle that says when you help more people, all ships rise together. If you want to be phenomenally wealthy, you just need to solve more problems. And I thought that sounded really cliche when I first heard that. I thought it was just hyperbole. But then I realized that's all a surgeon does, a heart surgeon or a neurological surgeon, they solve a very important problem for a lot of people. And they get compensated fairly and well to do that. Now, I'm not saying that all jobs are compensated fairly. If that was the case, then all of our elementary school teachers would be multimillionaires. And that's just not the case. But if you can find a way to solve a problem, a real genuine problem, if you see a hole in the market and you have the solution and you fill that solution, that's the way to create financial stability for yourself. And that is a sustainable financial stability. So I decided that I had to become good at sales. And as I started to get better at sales and I started, and I have to tell you, getting good at sales means authentically solving problems, solving real problems in an integrous way. When I got good at solving problems, that created wealth for me. It created wealth for my family. It's creating wealth for me now. And what I love about this, this, I don't want to call it profession. It's more than that. It's a calling. But I love about this calling is when I train other speakers, first of all, I'm very selective. I will not work with people whose missions I can't personally get behind. But when I do work with someone and then they get up on stage and we teach them how to communicate and we teach them how to offer, and I don't even know that influence is the right word when I when we teach them how to reveal solutions in an integrous way that when people buy it, they're excited to buy it. Maybe they're a little bit nervous, but that's okay. Then the people who I'm teaching to speak, they're making money now too. And the people that are learning from them are also growing in sometimes abundance. Sometimes they're growing in their relationships, sometimes they're growing in their health. And it's it's like instead of this win-lose scenario that you can have, it is a win-win. It's like sharing the light of a candle. You, when you share the light of a candle, the fire gets bigger, not smaller, which is crazy. And that's that that's a signal. That's a signal that you're doing something good when everybody wins. So I hate to oversimplify, well, I just got good at sales and then, you know, I became financially stable or multiple six figures or whatever it is. It it's it's learning how to solve problems for people. And I didn't do it right all the time. I messed up. When we learn, we screw up. We just do. So if you're in a position where you're saying, I have a message, more than a message, I have a modality, I have a framework, I have this, and I want to use it to help people, ask yourself this question. The day after you look at your bank account and see a million dollars in it, maybe you imagine it. Imagine you open up your bank account on your phone and you look in it, and there's a million dollars in the bank account, which for most people would represent more than enough wealth. What would you do the next day? What would you do the next day after you got that big dream stage that you're going for? If you can figure out what you would do the next day after you become whatever you're hoping to be, then start doing that today. And yes, you're gonna mess up just like I did. And yes, it's gonna take time just like it took for me. It wasn't selling every customer that came through the door. It was getting knocked down and being told no and handling rejection. And it was five years of learning how to do that before I could pull my head above water and cut up my food stamps card. It was five years of doing the work. It was five years of going to seminars, it was five years of speaking and getting feedback and not getting called back to come speak at a stage, and then sometimes getting called back to come speak at a stage. Consistency is what trumps everything. And you mentioned none of us are born with this ability of speaking. We like to think that, but if we think logically, I don't have not met a single baby that has come out of the womb with the ability to articulate language. It just doesn't happen. So we have to learn this, and that's good news. This skill can be learned. It is learnable, it's not just a gift that's bestowed on anybody.

SPEAKER_01 19:45

Exactly true. Exactly. And I mean also the part of that, right? For the listeners, I'm saying, because uh monetize your message can sound abstract until it touches the floor of someone's actual life. So to bring us into the everyday version, for a coach, expert, entrepreneur who are listening right now, who has a real message but no real engine around it yet. So what does that the business of speaking actually look like in the practical terms?

SPEAKER_00 20:17

Okay, so let's get tactical

A Practical Engine To Monetize Speaking

SPEAKER_00 20:18

here. Let's let's talk real, real demonstrable tactics. So there are a couple things. When you're starting with an idea, there's this beautiful principle of ikigai that the Japanese use to describe this intersection of where your passion and monetization and your purpose and things you're good at all intersect. And this is a beautiful little little bubble of, oh my gosh, I'm living my mission and I'm getting paid to do it, and it's just the best. So this is a principle that I encourage you to research. I won't go too deep into it here, but I want to keep it as the foundation because as Simon Sinek says, when we start with why, paraphrasing everything else falls into place. So this mission, this message that you have, first of all, you have to be so enrolled in it yourself that it passes the integrity test. It's not just a side hustle, it's not just a hype thing, it's something that's exceptionally important to you. And this is important because the tactical stuff will get difficult. It'll get in the way, so to speak, mentally, because it won't always work perfectly every time. And you have to be able to rely on your why to get through that. So the first portion is okay, in order for me to be able to monetize what I know, I have to have something to sell. And this will prevent a lot of people from taking the first step because they'll overthink this first step. They think, oh my gosh, I have to record an entire course. I have to put this workbook together, I have to throw an event, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. That's just not true. I'll never forget, I was in Fort Lauderdale, Florida, and I was at an event with about 300 people, beautiful ballroom, large event. And the speaker had the audience raise their hand in response to this question how many of you would like? To sell $500 worth of product right now. And of course, the entire room raises their hand, right? And then the speaker says, I he pulled out his credit card and he says, How many of you could pull out a point of sale system on your phone right now and I could swipe my card for $500 for a real product that you have in this moment? Six people raise their hand. Right. Like that's such a small percentage, 2% of the crowd raise their hand. So this thing that you have to have in exchange for real money, the first mistake I made is I created a course on sales and I spent hours in the studio recording it. We spent countless hours editing it. Nobody really wanted it, which is a huge mistake on my part. I made something that nobody had asked me for. There was no demand. And of course, yes, people need sales, but that's not what they were asking me for. When I finally listened to the feedback around me, people started asking me to train them to speak. They saw me on stage and they said, I want to be able to do what you just did. I want to be able to move the audience the way that you just moved the audience. So I finally listened and I started some one-on-one training. So this is my first tactical move for you. If you're listening to this, I want you to write this down. The first thing that you need to do is listen to the people and what they're asking you for and then start training one-on-one, one-on-one clients. Once you have enough one-on-one clients, you're going to be able to move on to step two. But first of all, you need to take this group of one-on-one clients, I would say at least 10 to 12 different one-on-one clients, and you're going to train them in what they're asking you for. And after you do that, you're going to start to find patterns. You're going to start to find common things that they're asking you for. And you're going to start to find that you're repeating yourself in a lot of different ways. This is good. Once you find yourself repeating yourself, you're going to start to understand, oh, I should really make a course around this one specific thing because I keep getting asked this question literally all the time. Then you're ready for the next step, which is to now record your course. Now record your online training. Now put together your workbooks because you have the feedback from your one-on-ones to justify the creation of course. And you also know that there's built-in demand for this. Once you find yourself repeating this, you can say, the next person that asks you, you know what, I built a $29 course around it. Here it is. Go grab it. And then from there, you can go up to higher things. So that takes you to step two. We'll record a course. Now, here's a general guideline I want you to keep in mind when it comes to the point where you're pricing products and creating products. I can show you how to do something for free. In fact, I'm going to record all the YouTube videos about it and I'm not going to charge for it. I'm going to show you how to do it. I'm going to show you for free. It's out there on the internet. If you want me to do it with you, now it's taking my time. My time is my most valuable resource and you deserve to be compensated for when something takes your time. If I'm going to do it for you, that's my highest priced product. For example, when I book people on stages, I book people on stages quite frequently. It's the funnest thing to do. I can teach them how to get booked on stages, and I do that for free all day long. I can do it with them, make introductions or even sit down with them and walk them through it and hold their hand where it takes my friend time. I don't want to make the mistake of saying that I charge for introductions. I don't do that. But when I'm sitting with someone in a classroom setting, they pay to be in that classroom and they take it far more seriously. When I do it for them, when I'm booking someone on a stage, that's when I charge my premium prices because they are all they have to do is show up and be the talent. And my team and I do the busy work. So when you're pricing things, do the same framework. If I I'll teach all day long for free. If you just listen to all my YouTube videos or read my book, you can do that for free. And I won't charge you. I just want you to be successful. In the middle, when you spend time with someone, that's when you start to put a price tag on it. And in the end, when you do it for them, that's the top price tag. So think about that. Those are the tactics of monetizing what you know. There's a lot of little pieces that go into this. You have to have a CRM. You have to have a place to house all of your data, all of your information. You have to have a call to action, something that your audience can do to work with you in the future. Those are important elements. But that foundational piece, you can't do anything without it.

SPEAKER_01 26:13

Exactly. Very, very true. So, so uh, Marianne, like if I have to ask you, like if you have to give one concrete suggestion to all the listeners today, then what that would be.

The Two Minute Live Challenge

SPEAKER_00 26:25

Here's what I would tell everybody. And this is a challenge that when I say it, people think, oh my gosh, that's almost too simple. But it also is very challenging. Not a lot of people will actually take me up on this. So when I first started teaching my public speaking class, I gave my students this challenge. And it was to go on social media, grab your phone, and go live for two minutes, but I want you to do it 50 times in a two-week period. Five zero. 50 times in a two-week period. Seems simple, right? Turn it on, go for two minutes, turn it off. You can do it multiple times a day. In fact, you'll need to. But most people won't take me up on this because they don't understand the value in getting the repetitions in. A lot of people, the biggest fear in the world is public speaking is because we fear judgment. We really do. And when you go live 50 times in two-week period, you're probably going to get some judgment. If you don't get judgment, you're probably not standing for something boldly enough. But when you can get the repetitions in of going live 50 times in a two-week period, now the stage becomes a lot less intimidating. Now your audience is starting to listen to you. They're starting to rely on you. They're starting to see you as a figurehead in your expertise. And getting the reps in is something that you will never stop doing. It's the old adage, use it or lose it. If you stop going to the gym, I'm sorry to inform you, your muscles will not stay. Ask me how I know, right? If you keep speaking, you're only going to get better at it. Your hundredth speech is going to be better than your tenth speech, but you can't have your hundredth speech unless you have your tenth speech. So pick up the phone and do it.

SPEAKER_01 28:09

Exactly.

How To Reach Marianne And Final Permission

SPEAKER_01 28:12

And if someone wants to connect with you, what would be the great way to connect?

SPEAKER_00 28:15

Well, I'm I'm pretty active on a lot of social media, although I am most active on Instagram. But if you're here stateside, just text me. 801-509-5495. Text me. I I love getting messages from listeners. I love getting messages on Instagram too, but I love interacting with you one-on-one personally. If you have a question, if I can be of service to you anyway, if your message is legal, moral, and ethical, let's get it out to more people.

SPEAKER_01 28:39

Amazing. What better can be? Lovely. So thank you so much, Mariam. It's genuinely, I mean, the there's a uh uh I would say particular kind of grip, grit and warmth that only comes from someone who's lived it all of it and uh refused to perform kind of any of it. So and and and and that combination is very rare on stage and even rarer in the uh podcast studio too. So I think the listeners can feel it and I'm really grateful that you brought it today. So for everyone who is listening, or maybe you'll be listening later as well, something if something here just moved you, just sit in it for a second because and before you move on or do something different. So especially if there's a message inside you that you have been quietly waiting for someone to give you permission to share, then consider this your permission. The world is louder. Yeah, yeah. The world is louder and than ever, but the real voices are kind of let's say quieter, starier and more themselves than ever. So yours can be one of them, right? So share this with someone whom you know who who's been calling themselves an aspiring speaker or kind of aspiring entrepreneur for too long, right? And maybe today's the day they dropped the word aspiring, right? So with this hope, this is your host awake, and this is my needs machine. We'll meet you back here soon, and until then, this is you. Stop performing the smaller version. The world is waiting for the real one. So thank you so much.