Courage To Start With Nothing

SPEAKER_01 0:22

Dear listeners, you know, like there is a particular kind of courage in landing somewhere new with almost nothing in your pockets, no safety net, no certainty, just the unspoken promise that you made to yourself that somehow, yes, somehow, you will figure it out. Most of us carry some version of that story, right? Whether it's crossing the ocean or crossing an ocean or walking uh away from the version of ourselves that stopped fitting. Right. So today we are talking to someone who turned that crossing into a life's walk. So welcome to Mind Meets Machine. I'm your host, Avik, and this is where we slow down and listen to the stories that rewire how we think about the change, identity, and what it really takes to build something that actually lasts. And with us, we have a very lovely guest. Please welcome you evidence. So welcome to the show.

SPEAKER_00 1:25

Hi, Avik. It's wonderful to be here.

SPEAKER_01 1:27

Thank you for having me today. Amazing, amazing. Thank you so much for joining us today. And uh dear lessons, like before we get into the discussion, I'd quickly have to introduce you with you. So he's the author of Retro Perspective, a time slip crime thriller that bridges 1980s London and today and a self-taught writer, photographer, and real estate investor who immigrated to North America in his twenties with almost nothing and rebuilt his life from scratch. There are a lot of things to learn from him. So I'll not take much of a time. Let's get started.

The Messy Middle Of Reinvention

SPEAKER_01 2:05

Welcome to the show again. A lot of people they imagine reinvention as this kind of clean break, right? Like you uh wake up one day and uh you are someone new. But you are lived in, I mean, you have lived in it like more than once, right? So what do you think is the biggest misconception here that people carry about starting over and over?

SPEAKER_00 2:30

Well, I think I think one of the sort of the biggest things is people don't really sort of grasp what's involved to do that. I think there's this sort of notion of being this armchair traveler um and having this desire to sort of do it from the comfort of your own living room, but actually taking those steps is an entirely different thing.

SPEAKER_01 2:47

So uh I mean when you uh when you were making those uh the early crossings, right? So what did you tell yourself to keep going like when the crown actually felt like it's unsteady, right?

SPEAKER_00 3:01

So yeah, no, it's yeah, no, I think it's it's really tough. I mean, I think I admire people who who take that step, who actually do it and take action. Because it's really tough. I mean, and especially when you're going from one country where you have a life, you have family, you have everything, going to somewhere where you have nothing and starting over. And I think a lot of the time, you know, people say, What are you crazy? Like what why are you doing this? But I think, you know, for the individual who does it, I think it it's about having that burning desire and sort of that that will to win within you. And I think that's the driving force. And I think that basically trumps everything. And you just you just have that strong desire, and you just say, you know what, no matter what it takes, I'm gonna make this happen. And no matter what setbacks I may face, I'm gonna make this happen, and you just keep going. Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 3:44

I mean it's it's easy to romanticize the leap. So I mean, there's like I mean, what you is naming here is the messy middle, like the part where you are neither who you were, nor who we I mean, who you are becoming. So that's what most of the real work happens. So it you like, I mean, you have moved between the countries, like identities, careers, everything. So I mean, what did those crossings teach you about uh what actually holds steady?

SPEAKER_00 4:18

Yeah, I I think sort of every time that you you sort of do it, you sort of it increases your confidence and I think your belief in yourself. Because I think the first time you try it, or the first time you move from one place to another, you feel very unsettled because it's a different environment. You've got to make new friends, you've got to make new networks, you've got to kind of start over again. So it it's really tough. But the more times you do it, I think the more confidence you get, and then you sort of realize there's a bit of a pattern here, and you sort of say, Well, okay, I've done it once before, I've done it twice before. I can do this again and I can make this work. Because I think one of the key things that I find is sort of to really sort of make it work. You just say to yourself, you get there and you say, This is it. This is what I have now, this is around me, this is it. There's nothing behind me anymore, everything's here or in front. And so you've got to just say, Okay, I'm here now, let's make it work, let's just make the best of it and do what we can to make it work.

SPEAKER_01 5:12

Correct.

Destiny, Regret, And Choosing The Leap

SPEAKER_01 5:13

Yeah. So was there a moment when you realized a thing that your building was not just a survival, but something you were choosing on purpose?

SPEAKER_00 5:22

Yeah, I I think so. I think the sort of the biggest thing, especially with a move to North America, was this I just felt this sort of gravitational pull. I felt like it was where my destiny was. You know, and I talked to people about it and even talked to my parents. I remember having a discussion with them at the kitchen table before I left, and they say, you know, you're crazy. I said, well, maybe I am, but I've got to try this. I've got to sort of see if I can make it work. Because I think, in some respects, like if you don't try something and you've wished to do something, there's a chance you could regret it for the rest of your life. And and I would, I was looking at it and saying, Well, you know what, I'll try it. I'll do my best to make it work, I'll try everything I can to make it work. And if I fail, at least I tried. At least I can say, well, at least I tried and made the effort and what have you. But that was kind of my sort of my my purpose, if you like. I was saying, you know, I'm gonna make this work, I'm gonna find a way, but if for whatever reason it does fail and end up going back home, you know, with my tail between my legs, at least I tried. Great.

SPEAKER_01 6:17

I mean, obviously, there's a quite difference between adapting because you have to and uh creating because you have decided to, but that shift is everything changes. So so if you if if you talk about our daily life, right? So for someone who is listening who's never uh left their hometown or uh changed their careers, so how does that kind of uh reinvention show up in everyday life, like what do you episode?

SPEAKER_00 6:40

Well, I think it when you move to a different country, um, I think you just have a different perspective because you're not from that country, you're from your own country. And I think you sort of appreciate the little things more. I mean, in my case, I certainly did. Like even just going for a walk to the shops, like going to the grocery store, seeing the items are available and just the interactions you had with people, it was just a very different environment. And and I think that that's for me, that's just crucial to sort of like appreciate all those little things around you. Because I think when you do that, what it does is it kind of energizes you to just do more and do better because you appreciate those little things so much. And I think often when you're born in a country and you're raised there and you work there, there is a tendency now and again sometimes to take things for granted because you don't know what it would be like to live somewhere else. Um, and I think also when you do go and move somewhere else, you also appreciate things back home more. So what was interesting is so when I first went back to the UK after coming to North America, I was like, wow, you know, I appreciate the grass, it's green, you know, I appreciate seeing my family, I appreciate these things that you know I left behind, and I appreciate the history more and stuff. So I think that's kind of like some elements of it is that you just appreciate the little things when you first move to a new country. And I think that's a way to kind of build upon what you have and just every day just kind of just move forward.

SPEAKER_02 8:00

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 8:01

So how do you recognize when it's time to uh let go of an old identity?

SPEAKER_00 8:06

Well, I I think it's different for everybody. I mean, it's it's a very sort of personal thing, but I think you just have to sort of understand what your beliefs are, what your focus is, where you envision your future being, and how does that line up with where you are now? I mean, because if it doesn't line up, and if you sort of feel, well, you know what, I feel like a square peg in a round hole, I just don't feel like I fit here anymore. And my desires and and what I would like to do is on the other side of the world or somewhere else where I think I can make myself a better life, then I think that's the signal to say, you know what, you just need to go for it. You absolutely need to go for it.

SPEAKER_02 8:42

Exactly, exactly.

Writing Retro Perspective As An Outlet

SPEAKER_01 8:44

And yeah, I mean reinvention does not always look like backing a suitcase. Uh sometimes it is just deciding, like that's a story that you have been uh telling yourself doesn't serve you anymore. Uh so you turned your own experience into the hardship and change into fiction. So, what does that process of translating lived experience into the creative work for you do?

SPEAKER_00 9:07

So Yeah, that's a really interesting question, Evic, and thank you for bringing that up. Um so I I think it's just sort of having that sort of you know creative focus, if you like. And sometimes it can be a very stressful situation. Yeah. So in my case, like I started writing the first draft of the novel when my son's mum was heavily pregnant. My son had yet to be born. I was stuck at home, it was the dead of winter, I was trying to run my own business, I was juggling all these plates, and I needed some kind of outlet to kind of sort of let the stress go. And so basically one day I just opened up my laptop in my office and I just started writing. And what sort of happened was that all these experiences from my life and all my interests and stuff from my childhood kind of all came together, and I just started writing and it just sort of came out. And the first draft was sort of very, you know, it was uh bit rough, I would say, around the edges. But what happened was it just I found myself sort of like having an outlet for all these experiences that I had in my life, like all the thoughts that I had locked inside my mind. And I just I wanted to share it and I wanted to sort of bring it to life in a way that people would enjoy reading it and uh perhaps they could relate to it in some kind of way. So for me it was it was almost like a I wouldn't say a flood is the right term, but it was like these thoughts and ideas just came rushing out of my head and onto the keyboard.

SPEAKER_01 10:30

So that's interesting.

Finding Mentors On A Self-Taught Road

SPEAKER_01 10:32

I mean and and when you're building something like which is self-caught, uh, whether it's writing or photography or investing, how do you stay kind of anchored? Like when there is no clear map or future roadmap, I'd say that is a really, really good question.

SPEAKER_00 10:49

Um and it's uh it's very difficult. I mean, my own experience is it's been very difficult. There are times when you think, why am I doing this? What are the reasons for me choosing to do this?

SPEAKER_02 11:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:02

But I think if you have this sort of end goal in mind, like say, for example, you want to complete a novel or you want to buy two investment properties, you'll find a way to navigate through it. But there is a lot of trial and error involved, especially when you're sort of doing it on your own, because you haven't got a mentor, you haven't got necessarily a support network, and it's up to you to find those mentors, to find that network and to find something that basically fits. Because again, when you're doing stuff like this, when you're learning it and you're self-taught, you know, there's people that you want to work with and people that you perhaps won't be able to relate to as well. So you just got to really find those people that work with you and you get along with, and then you just got to keep on going. And no matter what setbacks you may face, because you are gonna you are gonna have setbacks. There's no question about that. But you just gotta kind of you know look at them as an obstacle and say, okay, this obstacle's in the way, how do I get around it? And you'll find that it's probably one or two, maybe three, four, even five different ways to actually navigate around that obstacle or through it, and then you're back on track again. But one thing I would I would say to anyone that's uh self-teaching themselves anything is never ever get discouraged. I mean, even when you think there's a a roadblock or you think I don't know how I'm gonna do this, just focus on the will. Just say, you know what, I want to do this, and you'll figure out the how. Correct. Exactly.

Positive Mindset Through Setbacks

SPEAKER_01 12:17

And I mean, starting over once is I'd say hard enough. So you have built it multiple times across countries, careers. So how do you handle the inevitable setbacks? Like set up setbacks is something which I believe it's hard to handle. So what keeps you going when the new thing starts to feel like uncertain at last?

SPEAKER_00 12:39

Yeah, well, I think it's no matter how many times you try something or you start over, as you said, like you're always gonna have these setbacks. But I think you just gotta sort of have a positive attitude. I mean, I know that sounds cheesy and you hear these gurus all the time talk about having this mindset, but I think that really is the key. Um, just maintaining a positive mindset. And sometimes, you know, when things are difficult and when you're trying to accomplish a task and you find you're not getting any traction, or you just find there's just a dead end, stop, you know, take a deep breath, assess where you are, take a look around. And when that happens, sometimes you see something that perhaps you didn't see before. Like you might find an alternative way to do something, or you might be able to talk to a person that you didn't think would be able to help you, but they actually can. Or perhaps you yourself can contribute to something that you perhaps didn't think you could. And often it's just a a kind of uh way of just seeing the wider picture. You know, you just kind of got to broaden your horizons a little bit, take a step back, just look at where you are, and you'll be surprised sometimes that when you do that, you can actually find that way through that you didn't think you knew that was there to begin with.

SPEAKER_01 13:47

Very interesting. Yeah, that's really helpful. And so if you have to give one advice to the listeners today who are listening, what will you give?

SPEAKER_00 13:55

Well, I I think it's just if you've got a dream, if you've got a vision, there's something that you really want to do, something that's a kind of a burning desire, just focus on it. Don't give up on it, don't get discouraged. Because if you want something bad enough, you'll find a way to do it. And uh, you know, you put your mind to it and you'll be able to accomplish it. And uh as myself, I'm living proof that it works. And so I would say to listeners, you know, if you've got that dream, that desire, just go for it. Go for it, yes.

SPEAKER_01 14:22

That's very

Final Advice And How To Connect

SPEAKER_01 14:23

interesting. And if they want to connect with you, what would be the great medium to connect?

SPEAKER_00 14:27

Yeah, so you can connect to with me on uh Instagram at Hugh EvansBooks. You can also connect with me via my website, is uh huevins.me, and uh that provides a background on my novel retrospective, and also you can contact me directly through that as well.

SPEAKER_02 14:41

So yeah.

SPEAKER_00 14:42

Perfect.

SPEAKER_01 14:43

So the listeners, what I'll do is I'll put all the links, details, everything into the show notes for easy reference. And I'll just say like, you don't need to uh cross an ocean to start over, you just need to decide that who you were yesterday doesn't have to be who you are tomorrow, right? So thank you so much, you for sharing your perspectives, it's really really helpful. And uh if everyone of you are listening right now, or maybe you'll be listening later as well, I say it's you know, like this conversation is a kind of reminder that resilience is not about never falling, it is about learning to rebuild with the intention every single time. So if this landed for you, then please share it with someone who's standing at your own edge. And as always, uh take care of your mind because it is the only one that you have got. So please take care and we'll see you so much. Thank you so much.